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‘A worldwide leadership awakening’: Gallup’s Chairman on how work is changing

Updated May 30, 2023, 5:32am EDT

Jim Clifton, chairman of the research firm Gallup, has co-authored a new book, , that looks at how employment is changing, based on new data. We discuss how work culture is shifting. What are workplaces getting wrong today? And what should they be doing better?

Prashant Rao said:

Hey Jim! Thanks for doing this. We ask all the folks we interview this way to send us a selfie. Could you pop one over?

Jim Clifton said:

Prashant Rao said:

OK great, I got it!

Prashant Rao said:

To get things started, your book is all about the changing workplace and the world of work, particularly in the post-pandemic era. If we begin by looking backwards, what has been the single biggest change at Gallup in that time? Does that shift correspond to workplaces more generally?

Jim Clifton said:

Gallup professionals are like the rest of the office world, they don’t want the old routine. They want to work hard and do great purposeful work—but they don’t want to commute 4-5 days per week.

Prashant Rao said:

That makes sense, and is something I feel like lots of people are really looking for.

Prashant Rao said:

Do you get the sense that workplaces fully understand that this shift has taken place? You talk about how the Great Resignation should maybe be the Great Reshuffling — is that at all linked to what corporate bosses understand about their workforces?

Jim Clifton said:

CEOs are waiting for them to come back. CEOs and CHROs are doing a terrible job with the new will of worker. First they say, “make good decisions” and nobody comes in, so they are now changing it to, “come in or you are fired.” Employees are like dogs that don’t know how long their chains are — meaning, they don’t know how much freedom they have. This dumb leadership is creating enormous stress in the world’s workplace. (Editor’s note: Jim clarified the meaning of the comment about employees, which we have added above)

Prashant Rao said:

Ha, I like how you put it.

Prashant Rao said:

OK, final question: Looking forward, what’s a new idea about transforming workplaces that is really exciting to you or — put another way — what is a change in how we work that you think we are going to see more of, for the better?

Jim Clifton said:

We were failing at managing workplaces prior to covid. The world’s workplace has had only 15% of employees “engaged” at work. Humans shouldn’t hate work as much as they do. It is crushing global wellbeing as well as world productivity.

Jim Clifton said:

We need to get the “in office” days worked out—but it isn’t as important as intensifying the management of teams. Organizations that don’t intensify, will soon cycle out.

Jim Clifton said:

Humankind needs a worldwide leadership awakening, one that calls upon managers to develop the strengths of employees and have weekly meaningful conversations with them on goals and wellbeing—all aimed dead center on the customer. This is that moment where we can fix a very screwed up global workplace.

Prashant Rao said:

That’s fascinating.

Prashant Rao said:

Thanks Jim, have a great day, and good luck with the book!